theatre intel spots

[Michael James]

What I was getting at is, on one of my first shows, I started running before I could walk. I should have concentrated on sorting out the standard rig to a point where I could light the show well, but instead used all my time up adding scrollers to the rig.

 

Movers, just as everything else have there place. I don't think anyone (who is a good lampy) can say they hate movers because of xyz and so wouldn't ever use them.

 

And I have no problem using scrollers in shows when in busking. I struggle with moving heads. Its probably because I haven't done it enough, or it could be I'm using the wrong desk (530i).

 

Next time I use movers, I shall be using Vista PC, so that should speed things along nicely.

 

I hope thats cleared that one up.

[pete LD]

Having just read through this thread I cart believe how people are arguing about 102 s4s or 12 movers! There different! there for different things! if you need several specials in a smiler place on the stage it might be worth using a mover. I have just lit Titanic, I needed about 20 different specials from FOH all shuttered in on to something or a squared off so I hired 2 vl1000s knowing that there where all sorts of other things I could use them for but the 20 spots where a good start!

If you need a gobo wash of the stage its nice and easy to put a s4 on the pipe ends and x them over, nice easy gobo wash. if you need 2 gobo washes then you could put a gobo changer in the s4. if you need 3 then it might be better to use a mover but then 3 s4s on the pipe end might it depends on space dimmers budget what gobos you already have etc.

 

There are plenty of shows out there with an almost complete moving rig and if it don't move its got a scroller on! its far quicker cheaper and easier for a no1 tour to sway to movers. you dont have to spend stage time focusing which reduces the fit up time. you don't need 4 people round a scope and 1 up it and someone else calling the focus, you just need 1 prod lx on an overnight call tweaking the position groups. all the movers can be prerigged in the truss so you don't have to have 100s of flight cases.

so it depends on what your doing, if its touring, what you have available to start with(if its a tour you have nothing but if its staying in a theatre there will be a kit list as a base)

Its just annoying me that people are thinking its one or the other! if your designing for a venue that has 4 mac 2000s put the buggers on the rig in a useful place they could get you out the ####! if your in a venue that doesn't have 4 mac 2000s don't just hire them because they might get you out the ####! hire them because your design NEEDS them!

I'm gonna stop ranting now!

Thanks for listening!

Pete

[Ynot]

Having just read through this thread I cart believe how people are arguing about 102 s4s or 12 movers!

I think the argument in a way is a little one-sided...

Most of us are in agreement with you in that the best design uses elements of both generic and movers WHEN NEEDED, but very few designs (if any) will specify a rig consisting solely of moving heads. If nothing else, that sort of puts lots of eggs in one basket!

[JimWebber]

I do get the impression that certain parties in this thread are touting for a huge "Mover Vs Conventional" World title fight showdown. As Ynot, and several others heve mentioned, there is a place for both Generics and "Intelligents" in this wonderful world of lighting design of ours.

 

However, what I feel, is that there are (at least) two standpoints here, and I hate to mention names, but (purely for example) Ynot from the "Theatre" standpoint, and Michael James who appears to be coming from the "Concert" / "Gig" aspect. (Apologies If I am wrong) And although both parties make very valid points, they are trying to do subtly different jobs. (Althiough "MJ"s points about running before walking are valid to both streams)

 

I am "Theatre" based, so can naturally see the "Theatre" uses of movers, which I do believe are more limited then their "Concert" uses.

 

Good point however, even for a concert, you could have a reasonable result using purely generics, you would struggle to purely use so called "Intelligent" fixtures.

 

To sum up, I believe we are having an argument about what uses a piece of equipment may or may not have, but between people who want it to do different things.

 

For example, a spanner, has it's uses as a crude hammer, but it's really fantastic for thightning nuts...

 

Hope this makes a bit of sense!

 

Jim

 

EDIT---

 

I am not in any way insinuating that Ynot and Michael James are part of this world title fight, I've just picked on you as different users of Intelligents. Sorry Guys!

 

Jim

[Ynot]

However, what I feel, is that there are (at least) two standpoints here, and I hate to mention names, but (purely for example) Ynot from the "Theatre" standpoint, and Michael James who appears to be coming from the "Concert" / "Gig" aspect. (Apologies If I am wrong) And although both parties make very valid points, they are trying to do subtly different jobs. (Althiough "MJ"s points about running before walking are valid to both streams)

I work in theatre mainly, but we do also host various gigs as well, from dance to rock shows. So, as I've said at least twice here the availability of movers is just one of the tools in the box to be brought out as and when needed.

 

My main beef with what's been said is that except in unusual circumstances it's going to be pretty difficult to replace a properly set out rig of generics with nothing but movers - both practically and financially. You've gotta replace a whole lot of fixed lanterns before it becomes fiscally viable to do so!!

 

(Good analogy with the spanner, btw!)

[Michael James]

I am not in any way insinuating that Ynot and Michael James are part of this world title fight, I've just picked on you as different users of Intelligents. Sorry Guys!

 

No problem.

 

I do a lot of gigs, so your right about that one. All lights have there uses, Im not for or against movers. I personally don't have a use for movers just yet, but to argue about them seems a little silly.

 

EVERY fixture has its uses, and so should be used accordingly.

 

We had a show at work only a few months ago which was all moving heads. Not one generic. It was a first for us. The audience loved it and left saying "the lights were amazing". The house crew on the other hand didn't rate it because the cast wernt lit very well.

 

No one said it looked bad because it was just movers, but the problem was, they were not utilized very well. The show could have been lit really well with the same rig or it could also have been lit really badly with generics.

 

Its all relative.

 

Regards

 

Mic

[pete LD]

My main beef with what's been said is that except in unusual circumstances it's going to be pretty difficult to replace a properly set out rig of generics with nothing but movers - both practically and financially. You've gotta replace a whole lot of fixed lanterns before it becomes fiscally viable to do so!!

 

I was trying to say that there are so many different situations and ways of doing things. For you in a small local theatre(its about time I popped over to see your venue as im only 5 miles away!) hosting dance shows, bands and am dram, movers are an extra that are nice but not all that useful for everything. Where as a large no1 tour or west end musical the generics are sometimes the "extras" filling the gaps with movers doing the bulk of the work. Movers have got or getting to a stage where the extra cost of a rig of movers is outweighed by the cost of focus crew and the time it takes to do!(in pro theatre)

different venues have different pros and cons for the use of them and vastly different funds and ability

I would even go as far as saying that movers for school shows can be very useful, limited power available limited lantern stock, stick 4 mac 300s up and you have all your colour washes. solng as its being lit by a competent person who has put them there to be colour washes and not toys!

For example, a spanner, has it's uses as a crude hammer, but it's really fantastic for tightening nuts...

 

(Good analogy with the spanner, btw!)

 

I loved that to!

should start a good analogy thread!

Pete

[Ynot]

I was trying to say that there are so many different situations and ways of doing things.

Yup. Agree entirely there! :)

For you in a small local theatre hosting dance shows, bands and am dram, movers are an extra that are nice but not all that useful for everything. Where as a large no1 tour or west end musical the generics are sometimes the "extras" filling the gaps with movers doing the bulk of the work. Movers have got or getting to a stage where the extra cost of a rig of movers is outweighed by the cost of focus crew and the time it takes to do!(in pro theatre)

I'll back off a little here, though with reservations. Logic tells me it's unlikely to be fully satisfactory to replace ALL generics with movers, especially as I believe many (pro) venues will already have a house basic rig in place (don't they?). However, if, as a pro big-theatre sparks tell me different then I must capitulate. :P

(its about time I popped over to see your venue as im only 5 miles away!)

Too flippin' right!! :P Haven't met too many of the guys on the BR, but 5 miles away is riduclously close!! I know the Concordia fairly well, having worked both the old setup and the current one, though not recently, (and was involved in the refit to a comparitively small extent). Who knows, if you've been around there for a few years we may well have bumped into one another!! This weerk might be good - mid main panto, so I'm there every night except Friday (at the mo) and both shows Saturday. (and there's always the getout Sunday morning - always happy to welcome another pair of willing hands....!! ;) :D :D)

different venues have different pros and cons for the use of them and vastly different funds and ability

Oh yes!

I would even go as far as saying that movers for school shows can be very useful, limited power available limited lantern stock, stick 4 mac 300s up and you have all your colour washes. solng as its being lit by a competent person who has put them there to be colour washes and not toys!

Unfortunately, many schools would probably have them sat doing nowt most of the time, because they just don't have anyone remotely able to understand their use (and I mean teachers here, NOT puils, for all the reasons we've been through on here before!!)

 

For example, a spanner, has it's uses as a crude hammer, but it's really fantastic for tightening nuts...

 

(Good analogy with the spanner, btw!)

And there's always the fact that you may probably need the spanner as a hammer cos someone else is using the hammer as a screwdriver!! ;)

[Oovis]

Not wishing to sound like the 'if your a kid you shouldn't be doing it' gang. But if your flying truss in a pro venue

...

 

:P Nice, wish my school and shows that I worked on were like your school! Less time up a tallascope can't be bad. Lucky you for going to a school that has that much cash to throw at the lighting dept!

 

Tom

 

*fixed the spelling mistakes by the poster in quotes*

 

Ahem; Tallescope, you're :P

[frazer]

There is also a post active in Training & Qualifications regarding the use of intelligent lighting in the theatre.

 

http://www.blue-room.org.uk/index.php?showtopic=17365

[Entbbe]

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