Advice Sought on School Upgrade

[gareth]

Northwich - not somewhere I tend to pass on a regular basis, but if I'm anywhere nearby in the not-too--distant I'll get in touch!

 

As regards good suppliers - AC Lighting and Stage Electrics have always been very good for me in the past, and both have a local(ish) presence. AC Lighting in Leeds are on 0113 255 7666 (Jonathon Walters or Kevin Fitz-Simons are the guys to talk to). Stage Electrics head office in Bristol is 0117 982 7282 - Davie Bell looks after our part of the world - I only have his mobile number (he's not based in Bristol) which I'm not going to give out on the forum, but I'm sure the main switchboard will put you in touch with him.

[StevieR]

I'll second the recommendation for Mr Bell from Stage. Top bloke and totally honest although a very, very busy man at present. I've known him as a friend for quite a few years now.

 

If its of any help, I'm down in Oswestry at the weekend and will be coming back up on the Monday. Not too far off my route if you want a quick chat.

 

Steve

[niall]

Personally, I like the idea of hiring in lights and even a desk as and when we need them because a) there's no maintenance b) we can play around with different pieces of kit and c) because we're only likely to have it for a short period of time, we're more likely to take full advantage of it.

 

 

While this is a good approach to take, buying the desk is (depending on how often you will be doing shows with intelligent fixtures) a better route. It means that when the time comes that you bring in some heads/scans/etc you don't have to go about learning how to use a new desk (or reaquanting yourself everytime you get it). This route (for me anyway) is more likely to allow you to take full advantage of the kit you have hired in.

[WiLL]

I've worked in education-based theatres for a good few years now. I would say that based on what you've told us this sales-rep is not giving you what you need, but what he thinks he can get you to buy. For your needs, ask not to be quoted for moving lights, they are high maintenance and only look good when controlled by an operator who has good knowledge of how they work. Much more useful would be a good set of about 8 scrollers with parcans. These will increase your flexibilty whilst still being 'simple' enough for even english teachers to understand, they are also much harder to break through abuse, movers use High Discharge Lamps, which much like video projectors are very expensive and very easy to make go 'pop'. Go for the DMX upgrade, it will prove a sound investment for the future, likewise new dimmers and a DMX desk will also be a good move. The frog range is a nice blend of moving light capability combined with analogue style faders for the normal lanterns.

I repeat what others have said in saying; get two or three more quotes from different companies. Especially ones which have a local branch and you are likely to hire from, it PAYS to build up a rapport with a good firm as the reps WILL give you discounts to keep you sweet. To put it in context I have a great relationship with a large lighting hire and sale company and got my fat frog from them for under two grand. You are a school, and probably a charity so you look good on their books. Tell the reps that you are in contact with a few experienced theatre techs (even if it's stretching the truth) and will be taking their suggestions on proper kit. This will make the rep a little more wary about supplying you with fancy doo-dads that you don't need. When dealing with the reps themselves, try to always sound confident about the needs of your project, I apologise to any reps reading this but in my experience salesmen see hesitancy or lack of certainty as an opening to sneak in extra unnecessary kit and installations. I stress again, moving lights are the LAST thing on a list of priorities, they do make the list, but at the bottom. More important is; access equipment so you can adapt and maintain your lighting rig, infrastructure such as extra lighting positions, dimmers and upgrade to DMX, control desk, GENERIC lanterns- you could get a full set of scrollers with parcans and a few good fresnels for the price of those Robe's and they would stand in far greater stead.

In short you could spend the whole £8000 or however much in ways that will improve your lighting tenfold, or you could blow it all on 2 moving lights which won't get used for plays or most concerts and when they do get turned on will probably 'throw a spakky' from lack of maintenance.

 

Thus concludes my tuppence worth.

 

Good luck!

[mbthegreat]

Scrollers in front of source fours work very nicely at my place.

[Gerry]

Great advice guys! Cheers. I'm in Northwich btw Gareth.

Which school in Northwich?

I used to live in Northwich, I have been involved in shows at various schools in Northwich. I might know something about the kit and acess to it, that you have.

Cheers

Gerry

[simonbirdsey]

Some more great advice fellas. Keep it coming!

 

It's Leftwich High School, Gerry.

 

Si

[Gerry]

Some more great advice fellas. Keep it coming!

 

It's Leftwich High School, Gerry.

 

Si

 

It`s been a few years since I`ve been into Leftwich High School.

When I was last there I used the drama studio. A large square room with black curtain surround, flat floor and a balcony allow one side. Lighting control from balcony and easy access to ,with tallerscope/ tower, the lighting grid.

Lanterns mixture of Pat 123s and 23s, 3 Mini 2 racks and a 18 way mini 2 desk.

Is this the hall you are referring to?

As an aside, first time I went into the place the drama teacher, who was in charge of the lighting, was showing me the facilities. I asked him if hethere where any barn doors, he replied "you will have to ask the woodwork teacher" :** laughs out loud **:

Seems like the drama staff are still no more knowledgeable.

Chers

Gerry

[robloxley]

OK, I've read the thread but I'm still not clear what it is you want to achieve that you don't/can't at the moment, and you need to be clear on this before you can have any idea of how to spend any money.

 

Is it, for example, to improve access to existing lighting positions, add further lighting positions/fixed infrastructure, add more lanterns (and maybe therefore dimmers +/- new desk), buy some out & out 'toys', or get some training to make better use of what you already have??

 

Many schools I've seen would do well by investing such a sum in

1) access equipment and training to use it, particularly something usable by students

2) training to use their existing equipment to its best, maybe even some books!

3) a healthy stock of gel/gobos/barndoors/gelframes/cables/lamps to achieve 2)

before spending lots of money on fancy new equipment/toys. YMMV.

[simonbirdsey]

Gerry> yes, it's the hall that we're trying to improve. The 'Barn doors' gag cracked me up! Trying to work out which teacher it might be...I was here 15 years ago as a pupil (hmm)

 

Rob> we have come to our senses since the original post. The plan now is to get a trainer in in September, who could also help us to judge where best to spend. We'd then ideally like to raise the infrastructure to such a level that we can hire in moving heads and digital mixing desks as required.

 

As an aside, we're thinking that to reach the lighting positions, it would be very handy to have some scaffold. Buy or hire? And who would be a recommended supplier?

[PEPS]

Taking second opinions from other companies is a great way forward.

I agree with all before in that having moving heads when basic requirements are still to be addressed is not a good way forward. Build good fundamental operating foundations first then get the "whistles and bells" later.

You should have no problem finding reputable companies to come in and assist you and there are plenty that come with good recommendations.

Ones that we have had dealings with and would recommend are AC lighting (north), or Complete light and Sound Services (Birmingham).

 

Hope this helps