16amp to 13amp sockets

[jonathanhill]

Please don't. Metal clad sockets are designed to be fixed to a wall, not for use in trailing extension leads.

ay????? as long as you use the correct gland for the cable entry then what other problems are there? unless your mistaking metal back boxes foir metalclad pattresses

We've been down this comedy cul-de-sac before. Neither metal clad back boxes, or metal patresses are suitable for use as the termination for an extension lead, as they are designed to be fixed to a structure.

[timsabre]

Please don't. Metal clad sockets are designed to be fixed to a wall, not for use in trailing extension leads.

ay????? as long as you use the correct gland for the cable entry then what other problems are there? unless your mistaking metal back boxes foir metalclad pattresses

We've been down this comedy cul-de-sac before. Neither metal clad back boxes, or metal patresses are suitable for use as the termination for an extension lead, as they are designed to be fixed to a structure.

 

They are very commonly used in temporary power, mounted to a piece of ply with a surface mount 16A ceeform in and out.

 

Somewhat like these: http://www.gbaudio.co.uk/data/distrokit.htm

[Pete McCrea]

And I know of several companies (and yes, us included) that use a metal box socket with a 16A - 10cm Flex - Socket - 10cm Flex - 16A arrangement. Obvious a suitable cable glad secures the cables into the enclosure. These are used on our shows, visually inspected prior to use, used by experienced people and regularly tested as appropriate. Never had an issue with this arrangement.

[tokm]

Think the crux of the matter is whether or not the metal clads (usually multiples are mentioned by Pete & timsabre) are secured to a board or not.

 

Personally don't mind distro boards as per the pictures link, but wouldn't want to use a metal clad as a trailing socket/flying, even with a gland on the cable inlet. Would just look naff for a start, let alone any safety implications.

 

T

[TonyMitchell]

@ the OP

 

google "16a to 13a adaptor" and at the top of page one you'll find a ready made solution

 

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Images/Products/size_3/GW64204.JPG

 

Just a word of caution - irrespective of whether your distribution board is suitably IP rated to be placed outdoors with your generator, any 13a BS1363 connector isn't, so you should maintain IP44 (or IP67 if your risk assessment deems the higher rating necessary) whilst your cables & connectors are outdoors. These adaptors (or any you may make up) are only suitable for "indoor" usage.

[dbuckley]

You really are digging a grave! I can't say I've ever found a portable ring distribution system.

Interesting that, as (back when I was in the UK!) my 16A/13A and 32A/13A "boards" (you know, surface mount inlet, several metal clad 13A double sockets) were wired as rings, and I just ASSumed that everyone did it that way.....?

[Simon Lewis]

Cable glands may not provide the same retention force as a dedicated cable 'anchorage', so I have always gone for the Ceeform and Metalclads mounted on a piece of ply or MDF approach. I think I was inspired by Wigwam doing this back in the 80s.

I can see the argument that a Metalclad box isn't designed to be free standing. However, I do not see any problems with the mounted version.

My plugboards use 20mm wiring grommets between the Metalclad boxes, or, to give more space for the plugged in flexible cables, 20mm conduit couplers between the Metalclad boxes.

 

With regards to the internal wiring, a radial arrangement (in the correct csa wire) is perfectly adequate. The only time that I have seen a ring arrangement was in a portable 32A to 13A sockets dist board, which had been wired as a ring in 2.5mm^2 cable. Wiring it radially in 4 or 6mm^2 would have been acceptable.

[Jivemaster]

As the OP seems to have found out there is some serious science involved in "distro" and lots of opinion! You should have some questions for your tutor when this topic comes up on the course schedule.

 

I have several "bits of board" with a 32A input flex and a 13A metalclad with all the correct glands and cable grips, once used for breaking power out of a 32A supply for lots of muso things. I also have a 32 to 8 x 13A that is wired in the box as a ring circuit, -it's usually used for wall wart chargers.

[TomHoward]

There is no need for any additional protection as the fuse in the 13 amp plug will effectively protect the socket. the cable feeding it is covered by the protection on the 16 amp circuit.

The OP says he has 32A going into a 4x 16A distro, given the DIY nature there's no guarantees there is any 16A protection on those supplies.

[Simon Lewis]

The OP says he has 32A going into a 4x 16A distro, given the DIY nature there's no guarantees there is any 16A protection on those supplies.

 

I understand that there is indeed an MCB between the 32A and 16A, but I haven't seen the board in question...

[jonathanhill]

I understand that there is indeed an MCB between the 32A and 16A, but I haven't seen the board in question...

Is there not a requirement for RCD's or RCBO's on the 16A outputs under BS7909?

[Simon Lewis]

Is there not a requirement for RCD's or RCBO's on the 16A outputs under BS7909?

There is a requirement in this code of practice for RCDs on final circuits. It's recommended that the final distribution units have them. Therefore, one would expect RCDs on the 16A to 13A board, or on the 32A to 16A board.

 

I have not seen or had any involvement with the equipment in question, so cannot comment on the design.

 

Simon

[the kid]

@ the OP

 

google "16a to 13a adaptor" and at the top of page one you'll find a ready made solution

 

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Images/Products/size_3/GW64204.JPG

 

Just a word of caution - irrespective of whether your distribution board is suitably IP rated to be placed outdoors with your generator, any 13a BS1363 connector isn't, so you should maintain IP44 (or IP67 if your risk assessment deems the higher rating necessary) whilst your cables & connectors are outdoors. These adaptors (or any you may make up) are only suitable for "indoor" usage.

 

 

:D does such a thing exist for 15a?

[TomHoward]

For the price of them, would you not be better with two connectors and 12 inches of cable? They'd end up a big lump inline on a bar, especially as the cable enters and exits at right angles.

[TonyMitchell]

For the price of them, would you not be better with two connectors and 12 inches of cable?

 

sure, most of us here would do just that, but in the case of the OP I thought they may offer a readymade, safe and simple solution.

 

A concurrent post has been automatically merged from this point on.

 

does such a thing exist for 15a?

 

I haven't seen one and imagine not - I know we're only talking about 1 amp, but the principle of unprotected stepping down would come into play. Whereas the fuse in the 13a plugtop connected offers this protection in the 16-13 example I linked to, a 16-15 would have no such protection.