frazer Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 My apologies if this has already come up before.. So we're in the process of re-writing our PAT testing schedule and an interesting debate has arisen. Should we following HSE guidelines that stipulate that Class II appliances do not need to a combined inspection and test? See page 13 I have always in the past done an insulation on Class II appliances where there are exposed metal parts in the casing as this is the way I was trained. Any thoughts? Frazer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owain Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Where one figure is given, this is a guide for anticipated average use conditions; more demanding conditions of use will require more frequent formal visual inspectionsmore frequent formal visual inspections, and/or combined inspections and testsor combined inspections and tests. Where a range is shown, the small interval is for more demanding conditions of use and the longer interval is for less demanding ones. It is up to the duty holder, with appropriate advice where necessary, to assess the conditions affecting equipment, which may lead to potential damage and/or deterioration and should determine the maintenance regime. It is up to the duty holder, with appropriate advice where necessary, to assess the conditions affecting equipment, which may lead to potential damage and/or deterioration and should determine the maintenance regime. Depending on the environment in which it's used, it may be more appropriate to follow 'Construction' guideline of monthly tests for everything 240V. Or always test before use if this is something used infrequently and placed in storage. You can't have a blanket rule for all double-insulated appliances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerry davies Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Follow the links in This HSE have stopped scheduled PAT in their own offices to encourage people not to waste money on unnecessary testing. Obviously the environment and usage is what determines frequency but where the public are not going to come into contact with electrical equipment the parameters are less strenuous. The Colston Hall has been called a lot of things but a building site it is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathanhill Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 My apologies if this has already come up before.. So we're in the process of re-writing our PAT testing schedule and an interesting debate has arisen. Should we following HSE guidelines that stipulate that Class II appliances do not need to a combined inspection and test? See page 13 I have always in the past done an insulation on Class II appliances where there are exposed metal parts in the casing as this is the way I was trained. Any thoughts? Frazer It is down to your risk management how you structure, test and record electrical testing. A Class II appliance should have no exposed metal parts, and certainly no earthed metal parts, otherwise it would be a Class I appliance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 A Class II appliance should have no exposed metal parts...Not true. There is nothing to stop a Class II appliance having a completely metal enclosure or any number of metal bits exposed to touching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frazer Posted December 20, 2012 Author Share Posted December 20, 2012 A Class II appliance should have no exposed metal parts...Not true. There is nothing to stop a Class II appliance having a completely metal enclosure or any number of metal bits exposed to touching. My thoughts exactly. There are a lot of Class II DVD & CD players out there. Would you do an insulation test on these? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzly Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 There are a lot of Class II DVD & CD players out there. Would you do an insulation test on these? Yes, if your risk assessment regarding their usage, environment and maintenance history indicated so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 Yes, if your risk assessment regarding their usage, environment and maintenance history indicated so.Which is the correct answer for the OP. And everyone else with PAT questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnlinford Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 My thoughts exactly. There are a lot of Class II DVD & CD players out there. Would you do an insulation test on these? Given many Class II appliances (DVD players very commonly) don't even have an earth wire on their flex, and that most PAT testers link live and neutral and compare them to earth for the insulation test, I really fail to see what such a test would prove. If there was an earth wire present, then yes; otherwise, no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew C Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Given many Class II appliances (DVD players very commonly) don't even have an earth wire on their flex, and that most PAT testers link live and neutral and compare them to earth for the insulation test, I really fail to see what such a test would prove. If there was an earth wire present, then yes; otherwise, no.You really need to go back to step one and do some research. A Class II appliance MUST NOT be connected to earth. The insulation test is done between a probe, the case and the supply pins. Don't do any testing until you have received sufficient training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnlinford Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Given many Class II appliances (DVD players very commonly) don't even have an earth wire on their flex, and that most PAT testers link live and neutral and compare them to earth for the insulation test, I really fail to see what such a test would prove. If there was an earth wire present, then yes; otherwise, no.You really need to go back to step one and do some research. A Class II appliance MUST NOT be connected to earth. The insulation test is done between a probe, the case and the supply pins. Don't do any testing until you have received sufficient training. I'm quite aware that a Class II appliance must not be earthed, however if the flex has an earth cable in I would consider it worth testing the insulation in the flex hasn't deteriorated (and yes, I have come across examples of this, most commonly where an IEC input is used with the earth pin left unconnected and using a dedicated cable test for the IEC and thus no probe. I've also used a megger to test flexes when no other option is available). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 A Class II appliance MUST NOT be connected to earth. To be accurate... A Class II appliance does not have a Protective Earth connection but it can have a Functional Earth connection. So you CAN have a Class II device with a 3-pin plug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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