LED Pars

[Tomo]

If a unit provides more than just the RGB LED's then there is a greater chance of 'simulating' all the LEE filters but of course even harder to control! Maybe?

You've hit the nail on the head there!

 

The way to increase the gamut is to have more source colours available, just like in the more advanced colour printers - RYGCB might work.

 

A 16-bit variant of the HSI model would probably be the best way to control such a fixture, or maybe simply load the characteristics of every single Lee and Rosco gel into the device and treat it as an absolutely massive scroller. That would be rather cute actually, although you'd have to order the colours as in the Designer's swatchbook rather than by gel number to get decent fades between colours. Would make the personality for it rather complicated!

[AndrewR]

I agree that an internal gel library would be hugely usefull, but you still run it in a conventional mixing mode. As desks with gel librarys become more common its very easy to just open the gel window and pick a colour, as well as having the option of picking from a RGB pallete. That said I think it will be an expensive unit that has an internal library, and with a software desk with gel selection avalible for free (magicQ, plus the cost of a usb-DMX widget) it seems like a difficult choice, cheap unit with gel picking desk, or expensive unit with any desk.

[99benns]

Note that you only really need 3ch per unit (possibly 4 if you want the strobe) for DMX control.

 

Are you sure about that? The pars are 6 channel so if you used channels 1-4 on par one, and 5-8 on the second. won't channel 5 end up controling the preset colour on par number one and the red LED's on par number 2 at the same time?

[niclights]

I'm sure about the control channels needed, but I can't say whether that software lets you define which 36 channels you are controlling or whether they are simply on a 1-1 patch.

[russd1978]

My two Par56 LEDs arrived today - niclights is completely right, you can set them to phase through colours very very slowly if you need to without a DMX controller. Dont think you can set a static colour without DMX which seems a shame for small-time users like me. Thanks for all your help, these look great for my needs, noticeably less powerful that an equivalent standard par can, but I never needed that power anyway.

 

[Nicktaylor]

Reading back through the messages here. The units work like any other DMX device. So you are effectively setting the start DMX address and the number of channels needed counts up from there. So if you are using the Showtec devices, which I have just got six of, you set up the dip switch as usual. Of course as normal it is worth doing a test setting the start at channel one so you can make sure things are working okay

I note though that the dip switch is only eight dip, rather than the ten that I have on everything else. This obviously limits the number of units you can use separately on a desk. IE first 48 are dimmer channels, dip 7 is channel 64 and and from memory the eighth dip does something else.

So you can have the first unit starting at 49, then 55,61,67 and so on up to 127. Actually that is a lot separate units! But if you are running other multi-DMX units it will soon gobble them up.

I posted elsewhere this question. Is there a fixture set up in the zero 88 library for the LED units? Of course I have to find a floppy drive as well! ;)

[niclights]

I think I did highlight the 127 limit before, but whatever, you are absolutely right. Meant I had to use two universes!

 

 

So, another update. Units are finally installed and all working correctly under individual control with the Pearl (photo's are imminent).

 

In the final problem-solving stage I did discover a few other oddities with these ladies: As previously discussed the units need to be set to 'music' switch position to eliminate intermittent flashing under DMX. This introduces a couple of minor issues.

 

1) It seems best to make sure DMX (signal) is connected before powering up the fixtures, otherwise they might not respond. Also they sometimes initially stick on a colour and refuse to play. I have found a quick power-down/up solves this after which the units work ok.

 

2) Bizarrely they do appear to respond to sound even when addressed and receiving DMX, but only at very low levels. If there is no noise, nothing happens. If there is reasonable volume again, nothing happens, but if you have just the right level they flicker in white at their lowest brightness. In the club environment I intend them for this will not be an issue, nor would any live music. But if I were looking to use in a theatre I might be a little concerned.

 

Also I found another faulty unit which (after much of me looking like this - ;) ) turned out to be destroying the DMX for everything else on that universe (imagine 'when disco's go bad' :D ) This therefore brought the total number of faulty units to 2 out of 42. I swapped the bad LED board out for the one in the 'crazy' unit which still gave me 41 good.

 

That just leaves the programming then. Great

[Nicktaylor]

I think I am right in saying you should always power up the equipment that uses DMX before the desk, otherwise the DMX signal will not calibrate correctly with the equipment, or might not be seen at all!

[niclights]

I agree. I have always followed that rule in the past - power equip and then connect DMX signal, but these darn Showtec's seem to have their own way.... :)

[david.elsbury]

I think I am right in saying you should always power up the equipment that uses DMX before the desk, otherwise the DMX signal will not calibrate correctly with the equipment, or might not be seen at all!

I have to disagree, Nick.

If you power up the desk first, then the fixtures, as they are being powered up the fixtures will acknowledge that they have data, and should not go into a standalone mode (if applicable).

 

In my experience, if the fixtures get powered up first, they can sometimes go into strange modes where they will not respond to DMX without a power cycle.

 

Plus, especially with dimmers, if the desk is first, then the dimmers, (and if the power-off sequence is the reverse of this) then there is little to no possibility of "phantom" DMX values being seen by the dimmers and turning channels on.

(I have seen situations where the desk has been turned off before the dimmers, and almost the entire rig shot to 100% !!!! :) )

 

David

[Tomo]

As a general rule, always have the control signal prsent before powering up receiving equipment.

 

This applies to almost everything, be it an amp, a dimmer or a radio-controlled car to collect thrown discus (!)

 

As to dimmers giving phantom levels - every single channel in the dimmer rack on my last ship would gradually bring itself up to full over the course of around 30 minutes if no DMX signal was present.

[ianl]

I have just got some of the showtec pars,

 

I was sure I had read somewhere on the web that they could do a master slave thing ie no desk, first one on auto and all the others in the chain do the same thing

 

the rather limited and poorly translated manual dosent mention it

 

is this possible or was I dreaming again?

[whitehousejamie]

OK, it's been about a month since I invested in a pair of the Showtec 64's, and I have had both units develop faults where a row of green LED's stop working. Doesn't really fill me with confidence as you can imagine.

 

Currently waiting for a response from supplier to see what they say.

 

You get what you pay for!

[Light Console]

...both units develop faults where a row of green LED's stop working.

As has one of mine, and Thomann would exchange them, but since I have engraved them (dip switch settings), changed the plug, and used perminant pen under the "Passed" label, I think it is unfair to return them. At £60 a pop, I shall just work an extra day at some point down the line.

As you say, you get what you pay for.

"There are none so robbed, as those that get too much for their money."

[bertbass]

Hi and hello to every one. I'm new so if I get anything wrong I apologise in advance. I play in a 60s band and we generally play in pubs and clubs. We require, but seldom get, a stage size of 18ft width by 12ft depth. I would love to have a decent lighting rig, nothing over complicated just colour changes and blackouts at the end of songs. The mains power that we have available is normal single phase 30 amp mains. I suspect it's even less in some venues. The backline and P.A. could use up to 12 amps of this leaving not a lot for lighting, especially when you consider switch on surges. So the minimum of 4 par cans a side is out of the question. ( I would consider that 4 par cans with 500w lamps would be the least that would be needed considering the drop in light output when gels are added ). Also, the beam width of par cans means that on the stages (floors) that we are required to play on, all you get is a spot of light on the opposite wall and not a flood which we require. We at present use one 500w halogen flood a side, operated from a footswitch by the drummer. This gives a good spread of light and blackouts at the end of each song and doesn't tax the available power but is not very exciting and I had thought that this was all we had to look forward too until I recently found out about affordable low power consumption LED par cans. Today I found this forum and read through the LED par cans' threads and found out that I was not alone. So if any one can help me with my dilema I'd be over the moon. My question is, would 4, 2 a side, LED par cans, contrlled by DMX footswitch fill the stage with enough light, and not just spots of light on the opposite wall, for a decent show? If 4 is not enough how many would I need? Sorry if this seems long winded but I've tried to give all the info that I can.